Think Like a High Achiever: Secrets to Success with Craig Harper

 Andy
Get ready for some no nonsense tips and inspiring stories.  

You’re listening to The Tradie Show. This is the podcast for trade business and contracting bosses like you who want to lead with confidence, make more profit, and create a better lifestyle. 

Ange
We’re your hosts, Andy and Angela Smith, husband & wife team and co-founders of Lifestyle Tradie. Are you ready to have some fun? 

 Andy
Hell yeah!  This episode of The Tradie Show is brought to you by our partner, Buy4Tradies. The buying group built by tradies for tradies. Buy4Tradies secures better pricing on materials, fuel, and much, much more. For electricians, plumbers, air conditioning, solar, whatever trade you’re in. Find out how much you can save, plus go into a draw to win a mind blowing two grand voucher to help upgrade your tools. Head to buyfortradies.com.au. T&C’s apply.  

We’ve been lucky enough to have Craig speak at our Lifestyle Tradie Live event. And I have to say our members, mate, absolutely loved you. It was highly impactful and everyone went away thinking to themselves, wow, what are these new things I’m going to implement into their lives and get these new results. To be honest, mate, it was an absolute cracking session and everyone was raving about it. Welcome to the show, Craig. 

Craig
Thanks for having me, team. I feel bloody privileged. And also thanks for having me, you know, at your conference, what an awesome team. What an awesome culture you’ve built. I love the way that I didn’t really totally understand what you were about. And then it was like a light bulb came on when I got there and great culture, great energy, great people in the room and a very, very well run event, but I’m glad to be here. Thanks for having me. 

Ange
Thank you for those kind words. You definitely fit right in with our, uh, mob of trade business owners. So, uh, you talk our language. Mind you, you are highly, highly intelligent we’ve discovered. 

 Andy
Are you saying tradies aren’t highly intelligent and almost made it seem like he was well above us? 

Ange
No, he’s not above us, but he is definitely a wealth of knowledge. So we’re honored to have you with us here again, Craig, to share your wisdom.

Craig
I’m just a mildly sophisticated bogeyman,  that’s all I am.

 Andy
Love it. Love it. 

Ange
We’re already excited about what this episode brings.  So Craig, let me ask you this, we’re aware, but you have had an absolutely fascinating career both in health performance and human behavior. What actually inspired you to get into these fields?

Craig
I don’t think it was a single thing, but I was a pretty mediocre kid, you know, wasn’t a great athlete, wasn’t a great scholar, couldn’t sing, couldn’t dance, wasn’t immensely popular. You know, I think sometimes I think coming from a place where you’re not a superstar at anything can almost be a superpower because you have to work hard. So I was a morbidly obese kid, Ange, and you know, I was 10 kilos heavier when I was 14 years old than I am now. And, you know, with that, a bunch of physical, mental, emotional, social challenges, and I became really interested with how bodies worked and minds work and relationships and communication. And I was 14 years old when I kind of really had an epiphany about what I was doing with my life. And which is very early, I know, but I started to do a deep dive on the human experience then. I didn’t really know what questions I was asking or what answers I was getting, but You know, I’ve been fascinated with how people work for one of the more scientific terms. I’ve been fascinated with that for years. And so, you know, that, that really for me was the catalyst, human potential, like what can I do when I get out of my own way? What’s my ability, what’s my capacity for success and what does that mean for me in life and in business and in relationships and in, in mental health? So it’s been a lifelong journey, Ange. 

Ange
I think it is a lifelong journey and I don’t think it’s ever, ever ends, does it? I suppose. I suppose. What I love is that even at such an early age, you were asking so many questions of yourself to actually understand humans in general, which connects to the fact that I know when you were on stage with our Lifestyle Tradie members, you were talking about business owners in general, I suppose, and relating it to the fact that, We often talk about the way we think affects our lives. Can you articulate a bit about that and explain why it’s important for business owners to understand their own thinking patterns? 

Craig
Well, I mean, if, if we break it down to like really simple, a really simple concept, so there’s the stuff that’s happening in our world situation, circumstance, environment, business, customers, money, weather, government, traffic lights, heads in traffic, you know, all of that, right.  And, then there’s our response. You know, so there’s the thing that’s happening and then there’s my story about the thing that’s happening, right? So somebody might be sitting on a podcast with Andy and Ange thinking, Oh, this is terrifying. I’m terrified and they’re scared and blah, blah, blah. And their experience in the moment is one of terror and fear and anxiety and overthinking and self doubt. Now me who fortunately has done one million of these, my experience right now is comfort and enjoyment and curiosity. And I want to chat with you guys and I’m interested in you, but it’s not about the podcast or Ange and Andy, but rather about my response. And so when we start to think about how we think and how we react to the world and how we individually respond in different moments and situations, Then we just open the door on understanding our own mind. And if you can’t manage your mind, life is going to be hard. So I think, you know, trying to understand your mind, trying to understand your thinking, and this is really opening the door on consciousness and awareness. And I know this is very deep and philosophical for such a podcast, but I just think that, you know, whether or not we’re tradies or we’re neurosurgeons or we’re bloody podcasters  or we’re creatives.  We’re all humans, right? We’ve all got a brain. We’ve all got a mind. We’ve all got emotions. We’ve all got to self regulate. We’ve all got to look after ourselves and the people we love. And in the middle of all of the bullsh*t and the mayhem and the mess and the peaks and troughs and joy and pain and tears and laughter of life, I need to try and manage myself so that I’m not a complete prick to be around and so that I can do life well. And the same with you too, you know?

 Andy
Yeah, it’s interesting mate, isn’t it? Cause you know, as you know, we talked to heaps of tradies, heaps of people. And it’s just interesting. There’s, there’s some business owners that they make decisions, they make tough decisions, and when things go wrong, and I was very much like this, when things went wrong, yeah, we’d have a moment of what the f*ck just happened, but we just put it behind us, find a solution and move forward. But there’s a lot of people I deal with that when there’s an issue, it blows up. And they dwell on it, dwell on it, dwell on it. And they’re still talking about it a month later. And I’m like, what the fuck, why are you even bringing this up? It’s gone. So I’ve found myself, I’ve been very good. I don’t know if I haven’t trained for it. Just sort of comes a bit natural to me. It’s done. I can’t change it. Move on. Let’s go. I mean, I know the brain’s a very interesting place, but how does someone change from this to that? Or what,  what’s your thinking around that?

Craig
Yeah, that’s a really good point. We, I mean, the bottom line, Andy, is we waste a lot of time and energy on sh*t we can’t control.

Ange
Yeah, good point. 

Craig
And the reason that we do that is not because it’s logical or practical or it creates a positive outcome. It’s because we’re emotional and being emotional is not bad. Of course, I’m emotional, but it’s being able to recognize in the moment that this reaction is not a great reaction. Let’s say I’m standing at the side of the room and I’m ready to go on stage at your conference and I’m talking So I might feel in the moment, like my emotion, my feeling is off and hell, this is the day I’m going to stuff it up this, uh, they pay me all this though. I’m going to be ****, they won’t like me. This is all fear and anxiety that I can be feeling while simultaneously knowing. So this is the brain, Craig, you’re actually quite good at this. This is your job. You do this a lot. You’ve got it. So this intellectual or cognitive understanding, that one, I’m quite good at this. But also this fear in the same moment, Oh, this is the day I stuff it up and I crash and burn and my career’s over and they’ll hate me and they’ll want their dough back and everyone will throw shit at me. Like these things can coexist. Like these things, this, the fear and the irrationality and the self doubt and the self loathing can coexist with the, with the knowledge that it’s probably going to be all right though. And so the challenge, Andy, is in the moment to be able to, in the moment, in the situation, realize right now I’m just wasting energy on sh*t that’s out of my control. That doesn’t make me bad. That makes me human. But with that awareness now, what do I do? Okay, let’s ask a good question. What’s one thing I can do right now to move in a positive direction? That’s a good question. What’s not in my control? That’s a good question. Okay, what is in my control? So in terms of what I want to do, be creating change, where does my attention need to be now? You know, and it’s, It’s look, it’s an ongoing process. I teach this stuff and I f*cked up 12 times a day, right? So we’re not looking for perfection. We’re looking for growth.

 Andy
Yeah, a hundred percent. I think everyone’s got to feel themselves go. Am I a bit like that? Do I go down that rabbit hole or do I just get on with it? So the other big thing in business is how other people see you as a business owner. So, how, you know, how can this awareness help business owners build better relationships with their clients in their teams? 

Craig
Yeah, that’s also a good question. So, I mean, there’s self awareness, which is understanding how I am and why I am the way I am. And, oh, look, I’m in the moment. I just did this thing to try and impress Andy and Ange, right? That’s self awareness, right? Other awareness in a, in other words, situational awareness or social awareness, or my PhD research, which is around meta perception, which is understanding how others see you. Now in business, we might call that our brand. Yeah. You know, how do people see you? What is their perception of you? And does it matter? Well, of course it matters because if people think you’re ****, they’re not employing you, they’re not working with you. 

 Andy
Oh, yes. Agreed. 

Craig
So, I mean, like when people go, Oh, I don’t give a f*ck what people think of me. Well, you’re an idiot.

 Andy
Yeah. Yeah.

Craig
Because what people think of you, especially in business is your reputation, your brand. Now there’s a difference between being obsessed with whether or not people like you. That’s fear based insecurity. But from a business point of view. You know, you’re selling you. Yes, you might be selling, you know, carpentry or whatever specific skill set you have. Um, but ultimately you want people to believe that you are a good brand. You are a good business. You are a good tradesman. You provide good work. You provide good value. And all of this comes under the umbrella of how people see and perceive and process you. Either as an individual or as an organization. So it’s like the reason that you would bring me to your conference and say, Craig, we want you to fly from Victoria up here. We’re going to pay you X amount because on some level you think I am worth that. That’s perception. And I might go, what about Brian over here? You’re like, f*ck Brian, when I’m paying Brian, but Brian could be better than me. Yeah. Right. Brian could be better than me, but Brian doesn’t have a brand and you don’t think Brian’s worth that. So f*ck Brian, you with me? You know, on a level it’s like, I think about this a lot. I mean, I know people who get paid 40 grand a day, 40 grand a day. I mean, how on earth, but if a company or an organization thinks that that particular individual is worth 40 grand a day to consult or speak or run a workshop and they’re prepared to pay for it, then guess what? Then that person is worth it. Cause that’s what they’re charging and that’s what people are paying. Now, as obscene as that seems, but then somebody else might be as good as Mr. or Mrs. 40 grand, but no one knows who they are. No one thinks they’re any good and they don’t have that brand. And so people won’t pay two grand. So there’s the thing that people are getting. And then there’s perception and perception is very important. 

Ange
Interestingly for trade business owners, this is one, even though they can definitely become really obsessed around how others perceive them and therefore their relationships with clients and teams. We both know that just the pressure of running a trade business or any business, let’s say is super stressful, right? So in your opinion, what are some simple strategies that business owners can use to handle stress and stay calm under pressure? 

Craig
Yeah. So, for me, I have three people that work for me. So all the **** I’m bad at it, they do.

Ange
Perfect. 

 Andy
Great. 

Craig
And all the stuff I’m good at, I do. And that’s why I have so many staff. Exactly. Like I say to, I mean, over the years I owned gyms and I think you know my backstory, but I employed 500 people over 25 years. But these days I don’t own gyms, small operations, corporate consulting, speaking, blah, blah, blah. But I have three people and So what I do is I go, Oh, this is the thing that needs to get done. Who’s the best person for thing, for this? And it’s definitely not, you know, the ex fat kid from Latrobe Valley.  Right. So  I’d send you what we’re not doing. We’re not getting Craig to re-engineer the website. That’s what we’re not doing. You know, what we’re not doing is building a payment gateway in the bloody, you know, whatever, what we’re not doing is getting Craig to respond to these 900  emails with these big fat typey fingers, you know? So. There’s not one strategy. There’s, there’s a bunch, but one of the ways is to figure out what is efficient, what is inefficient, you know? And I think when you’re, you know, Gerber wrote a book called the E myth, which I’m sure you’ve heard of, but the key message in the E myth is that it’s impossible to work optimally in the business and also on the business, which I’m sure you guys teach. And so sometimes we need to try to zoom out from the micro of the day to day and get a look at the macro of our overall organization, whether it’s a company of three or 300 and figure out in terms of what we want to do to create moving forward, what is efficient and what is inefficient. And also, if I look at my current operating system, what am I doing that doesn’t work? And what am I doing that does work? And one of the challenges is, as you know, because you both own a great business, but when it’s your business, you’re emotional. And so it’s, as much as possible, emotion is great because it means we love what we do and we’re passionate, but also sometimes emotion equals bad decision making and bad responding. So as much as possible, we want to tone down the emotion and tone up the logic and the strategy and the structure and the process and the accountability, all that very cerebral logical stuff.

 Andy
Yeah. And really what you’re saying is just take it on board. If you’re feeling a bit stressed, how are you going to deal with that stress? Take those deep breaths and be logical about how you’re going to fix it. But when most people are stressed, they’re not logical. They’re just like,  and they just keep going and go and they wind themselves up. Banap banap banap! They’re like a coiled spring on there and explode. And there’s no doubt I’ve been there at times. Haven’t I, Ange, over the years? Mate, you’ve worked with so many successful people. What are some of the common habits of high achievers? Just so our listeners can look at adapting to that.

Craig
I think one of the starting points is to get clear about what success means for you, right? And obviously in business, we tend to equate turnover, bottom line, you know, profit with success and understandably, but then maybe you peel that back a little bit and go, but yeah, me as the person in the middle of the business, is it possible that I’m making heaps of dough and ticking all the boxes and the organization’s killing it, but in the middle of it, it’s killing me literally. 

 Andy
100%.

Craig
And that is true sometimes. And so, yes, I want a good business and brand and I want to make money and I want a good turnover and I want to please customers and clients and, you know, I want to be winning, of course, but at the same time, I don’t want to be medicated for anxiety and depression and sleeplessness. And I talk with those and work with those people regularly, people who are from the outside looking in, successful. But the inside out falling apart, you know, they’re a f*cking train wreck, mental, emotional, social, physical train wreck because 99 percent of their time, effort, energy, focus, and concentration is on the business, you know, so we need to know where that line is. And so in workplace culture for years, we talk about this thing called work life balance. I think work life balance is an outdated term and concept. And so I talk about the idea of work impact because work life balance is essentially almost like an equation. Hey, edge, if you work this much and you don’t work this much, we get this almost this, this balance of working and non working. And then you found the magic formula. Well, maybe, but What if Ange does 20 hours a week of something that she hates, but Andy does 60 hours a week of something that he f*cking loves? Yes. Right? So the emotional and psychological toil will be more on Ange than Andy because she does not enjoy it. For her, it’s toxic. So it’s trying to find, yes, the right amount of hours, but also  The relationship that we have with the work. So right now I’m in my office. I’ve been working since six. It’s 9:29. As we record after this, I’ve got more stuff to do. And this is what I’m doing right now. Part of my work day, but nothing about it feels like work. Right? Yeah. I’m not sitting here thinking, Oh, I can’t wait for this to be over. This is horrible. Like for me, this is hanging out with two cool people having an experience. And I’m lucky that that’s what my job looks like. Yeah. I mean, to me, it’s bullshit. It’s like, this is a hack. How much fun is this that I get to do this. And this is a job,  you know, and all the stuff  flying into state to work for you guys and getting paid lots of dough to do the thing that I love anyway, like I’ve got the biggest scam of all time.  

Ange
You’ve created the perfect life because you decided what life needed to look like for you so that you enjoyed it, is the sentence.

Craig
Yeah. Well, I think you bring up a good point and this is about having a conscious awareness of how we develop our business to work for us, not only financially, but also in terms of our physical, mental and emotional health. 

 Andy
And that’s why with our branding, we’re called Lifestyle Tradie and not Make a Shitload More Profit Tradie. And don’t worry, all our members are doing very well. But it’s about the lifestyle. It’s about what do you want out of life? Let’s make it a happy environment for you. If it’s 10 hours, 60 hours, and you know, there’s a lot of tradies that want to work 60 hours a week and some work on the tools and they love it. And there’s others that don’t want to work at all. So it’s a mixture of what you want and it’s your lifestyle. It’s your decision. So no, I agree with everything you said there. 

Ange
You know what I find really interesting though, when working with trade business owners for over 15 years. They tell us that they really want change, right? And so they become a member. And then when you start working with them as a human, so yes, we can help them make the changes, make them more profitable, more seamless, you know, connect their team, whatever. But if they don’t drop the guard about themselves, we have a problem because so many people struggle with self doubt and self sabotage that we almost hear sometimes excuses immediately as to why that won’t work for me or why that thing won’t work in my business, my town, my city. So when you think about self doubt and self sabotage, maybe they’ve drawn this from their past, being a child, you know, now they’re an adult. Yeah. In your opinion, Craig, what practical steps can they actually take to overcome these challenges? Because we see these challenges often. 

Craig
So. It’s like people wanna be at the top of the mountain, Ange, but they don’t want to climb the fucking mountain. 

 Andy
Yeah, yeah, a hundred percent.

Craig
They want the summit, but they don’t want the climb. They want the reward without the work. But how does self-belief grow? Well, self-belief and resilience and skill and awareness grow in the middle of pain and discomfort and uncertainty. And so while people like the idea of a business that’s now turning over three times what it was last year, they like that idea. But what they don’t like often is the things that they’ll need to do to create that outcome, right? Yes. And so I like the idea of change, but not the process. So is there a quick fix? Is there a magic pill? And this is why instant gratification or the idea of instant gratification sells so well, but you know, it’s like I started my PhD when I was  56, right? I’m 55, I think. And I’m coming up to the end of my fifth year and I’ll be finished soon, right? But the idea of doing a PhD and the practical reality of doing it, Like I thought it was, I got off at a PhD place. I went, I, and really it was just my ego. Cause I went **** doctor. How good is that? Yeah. I didn’t really think it through because I’m just a Bogan from the country and I’m not that clever anyway. But once I got into it, I went off shit. This is a nightmare. What have I done? But the truth is. It’s hard. It’s uncomfortable. There was a steep learning curve for me. And then now five years later, um, I’m nearly finished. I know how to do an inverted commas academia and write like an academic and do research and interpret data and write papers. And, you know, but I didn’t know that really, like I’d done an undergrad degree, but it’s completely different, but you can’t get good at the thing that you won’t do. Right. So we need to go, what is the thing that I need to do that I’m currently not doing that will propel me and my business closer towards whatever I think success is.

 Andy
Yeah, it’s true. It’s true, isn’t it? You’ve just got to, I mean, it’s interesting how many people go, I don’t know if I can do that. It won’t work. It’s not going to work for me. And I suppose the beauty of Lifestyle Tradie and being around for 16 years, we go, well, there’s another 200 people in the room that have done it. So why are you different from them? And they go, Oh, and there’s been thousands and thousands before them. Why are you different from them? And sometimes they start to go, Oh, wow, that’s so true. 

Ange
And God, there’s a little voice in there. You were talking about number four, this conversation constantly going on in your own mind that you’ve got to start leaning, you know, one to, to the positive voice versus the negative voice. So that’s telling you can or can’t do that. 

 Andy
I did a marathon last year and that marathon I did, I trained for three weeks before it, and I wasn’t a runner before it. So as you can imagine,  world of, world of pain,  and I’ve only run about 2, 5K since then. It’s over a year later. Like I f*cked my running career, which I didn’t have, but I had two devils on my soul, that arm on my shoulders, that whole 40 kilometers. And holy crap, it’s hard blocking that noise out, but geez, I was mentally stronger after that. I couldn’t believe how much mentally stronger I was.

Craig
Yeah. Do you know what I love? I mean, firstly, you are an idiot, but secondly, this is the exercise physiologist talking, right? But to your credit, Andy, yeah. It’s fucking amazing what we can do, even when we’re not really prepared, even when maybe a little bit underdone in terms of, you know, fitness or skill or knowledge. But when our commitment is 120%,  we’re going to produce some fucking crazy outcomes versus the other person who’s got all the training, all the skill, all the knowledge, all the quals, but you know, I’ll have a go and I’ll see what happens. Right. Give me the person who’s driven anytime. I’d rather have less talent, less skill, more passion.

Ange
More passion. 

 Andy
A hundred percent. I mean, I remember saying to Ange at the start of the race, I said, there’s two ways this is going to play out. And she said, what? I said, I’m either going to crawl across that fucking line or I’m going to be shipped off in an ambulance. Like I’m not fucking stopping until I get through. And it wasn’t fast. It was over, it was just over five hours. So it was a very slow run, but geez, it hurt. It bloody hurt. But that mindset around that is just. Which is huge for me. So even with yourself, mate, you’re like, you’ve come so far from, you know, the overweight teenager to the health expert, to the gym guide, like you’ve been everywhere. You’ve done that. You’re highly successful. What motivates you and what keeps you going and how can some of our members take on some of that so they can make some big changes in their lives? 

Craig
Yeah. So I’m really interested in this concept of designing my life. I’m not scared of hard work. I want to work hard. I don’t want things to be handed to me, but I also think that. A lot of people, and maybe, maybe some of your listeners, maybe not some, but a lot of people basically do life on autopilot where we kind of do that isn’t really working. You know, it’s like, here’s an example. I spoke to a guy yesterday and I said, it wasn’t a consultation. It was just a guy. Somebody asked me to talk to him, right? Who’s struggling a bit. And I said, um, so one to 10, how important is your health? And he goes, Oh, eight. Now the guy who says that his health is a priority. And eight out of 10 are currently eating junk food every day and drinking booze every day while simultaneously telling me that health is a priority, right? Now I’m not, I’m not running him down. What I’m saying is we have the capacity to do stuff that doesn’t work for a very long time while kind of subconsciously hoping things work out. Yes. Well, that’s a terrible plan, right? So that’s, that’s, you might as well just roll the dice. So I go, alright, well, I’m a 60 year old dude and my body type is what we call endomorph, which means I walk past a donut and my ass gets bigger. That’s my genetic disposition, right? And you go, alright, well, I can’t wake up tomorrow and be 24. I can’t wake up tomorrow and have mesomorphic genes, which are better genes. I can’t wake up tomorrow and have 26 hours in a day. I can’t wake up tomorrow and have a different history or a higher IQ or more talent, but what can I do? Today or tomorrow. Well, I can make better decisions. I can get clear about my non-negotiables as we spoke about at the conference. I can figure out what I’m currently doing, which is stupid based on my values. Yeah. Right. Because none of us are going to accidentally end up successful if we’re serious about living what are close to our best life personally, professionally, socially, emotionally, spiritually, physiologically. Then there’s work to do. And for me, this is really about opening the door on consciously living our best life and saying, what am I doing in my life? Whether that’s in my business, in my relationships, what am I doing? That’s not currently working. And why am I doing that? And how can I do better? It’s an, it’s not rocket science, but figuring out how you work best.

 Andy
It’s interesting you say that. And I, and I was just listening to all of that. And I was thinking that the majority of our listeners are trade business owners that own their own business, right? Yeah. There’s not a trade business owner that I’ve really come across that doesn’t understand what hard work is and as hard as happy at times to get in the trenches and do the freaking hard work. So they’re not opposed to hard work to get to where they need to go, but what they’re doing is they’re working on the wrong thing and they’re not following the right path to get success in business. So they’re happy to do the hard work, but they’re not happy to learn from maybe someone that’s been there or done that, or have different people in their lives to actually drive them and help them to be better. What do you say about that? 

Craig
Yeah. So, hard work is important. All the tradies that I know, um, rep in line with what you said, you know, they, they work hard and, and they’re definitely not lazy. And I think it’s having the right strategy. It’s like, let’s say I want to drive from Melbourne to, um, Sydney and I’m really passionate and focused and committed, but I head towards Perth. Yeah, you know, and I go to Sydney via Perth. Well, I’ll get to Sydney, but f*cking hell Craig, there was a much quicker, much more efficient, much more effective. And this geographical metaphor is lots of people in business literally taking their business to Sydney from Melbourne via Perth, you know, and it’s like working hard is great and having a good attitude and not being lazy is great. But now let’s talk about strategy, optimization and efficiency. You know, it is very hard to be objective about the thing that you are in the middle of, because you are in the middle of it. Right. Yes. So somebody like you guys who are outside of their businesses. Which is, I guess, how and why you’re succeeding because you can see maybe what they can’t.

 Andy
Yes. Great. 

Craig
And so in human behavior, I call this colloquially, I call this an unreasonable friend. I think we all need an unreasonable friend, either personally or professionally. And that’s the person that loves you, knows you, cares about you, wants the best for you, but will also say,  Something between, hey, that’s f*cking amazing, well done, or I think you’re f*cking that up, here’s another idea, right? What we don’t need is a fan club. What we need is, we need genuine quality input, and we need to try to find a way to turn down the emotion, because it’s very easy to be defensive. Like, everyone wants feedback until they get feedback. 

 Andy
That is so true.

Craig
So, Oh, no, I’m open. Tell me. And then they’re like, no, f*ck you, all right, well, you don’t want feedback at all. You want, you want to rub on the back and a trophy and a fan club. So,  you know, here’s the, here’s the truth. You guys and myself and every distance we’ll things up repeatedly through the lifespan, because that’s what humans do. We’ll also get lots of things right. And it’s not about self loathing. It’s about self awareness. You know, with my show, with my podcast, I’m heading towards 2000 episodes, the first 600 episodes and mine’s a commercial podcast. The first 600 episodes that I did, I lost money. It cost me money. And it took me two years before I made one set, but I knew that in all of those 600 episodes, I was gaining insight and skill and knowledge and awareness and building a brand. And eventually, but I had to fuck up for two years before I started to get a run on the board. So, and it wasn’t fucking up, but it was depending on how you measure failure and success. But that’s the beauty of it. Like how do you become a black belt in anything where you put on your white belt and you go to the dojo and get the kicked out of you for about five, six, seven years. And then eventually if you, if you stick around and you do the work and you don’t give up, you become a black belt. It’s the same in business.

Ange
What I love is that you’ve touched on the fact a couple of times here that you needed what is the ultimate plan. So you need to actually stop, elevate yourself, not just about your business, but just about you as a human to say, what do I actually want out of life? Like, what, why am I working so hard? What am I driven for? What drives me and why do I get up in the morning and what do I love most? Cause that’s where I should actually be spending my time. We spent a lot of time actually without members of Lifestyle Tradie when they first came in. Even though yes, we’re there to help fix their business, make them more profitable, streamlined, all those things, you know, but what is important is to actually go back to this. Life by design, we call it. You naturally need to might be a little bit woo woo for some of the blokes, you know, often, sometimes I start rolling their eyes and we’re like, no, no, no, you need to come back to grassroots and tell me what is the future look like five, five years, 10 years away. And are you even on the same page as your wife, as your partner? So when you know this about you and you actually put this down on paper and have a conversation with your partner, then these good habits have to now kick in to go, well, how can I be consistent to ensure that every single time I do that thing, I’m going to end up with that result. Like your example about the podcast. So, you know, you knew 600, you know, episodes in not making money, but I know that there’s a dream I’m just going to keep going. 

 Andy
So mate, what practical advice do you have for business owners? Because quite a few of them will come to me and they say, I want to change my mindset. So how do these tradies actually do that?

Craig
Yes. So there’s a couple of ways. If we remember, I think at the Lifestyle Tradie conference, we spoke about this idea in, in psychology called metacognition. Do you remember that fancy word? Yes. And metacognition is just a fancy word for thinking about thinking. And then back to your specific question, how do we change the way that we think? So there are a couple of ways and, and it’s not one or the other, it’s a couple of ways. So for example, mate, when you did that marathon, your goal was to run the marathon. Your goal wasn’t to change the way you think it was to go and do a physical thing and you went 40, 42. 2 Ks. It’s going to be and you did the marathon. And I would imagine that. That had an impact on your thinking. Maybe it didn’t revolutionize your brain, but it gave you a level of awareness or confidence or understanding of what’s possible for you. Right? So there are a couple of ways, like, how do I change the way that I think? So let’s say for example, I’m terrified of public speaking, but nonetheless, I put myself in a position where I’m going to go and do a five minute presentation. I’m terrified. I’m full of self doubt and anxiety, but I go and I do it. I don’t die. It goes. Oh, it’s not brilliant, but it goes. Okay. Then all of a sudden, the next time I’ve got to do it, my terror is not a 10. My terror is a six and I go a little bit better and so on. Now by the 10th time, I think totally differently. And my thinking now doesn’t have that emotional response of terror and anxiety and self doubt and panic. But how I changed my thinking was I went and did something so we can change the way that we think through our behavior and through taking chances and having new experiences and doing new things. And so a practical example of that might be in business where, um, let’s say for tradies where we go, Hey, mate, using the old, you know, the spiral bound book and the pen and the paper, and we might need to update you and modernize. We might get a little bit more systemized and a little bit more high tech. And they’re like, Oh no, I’ve done that since the eighties. And  then eventually  they get to the point where everything’s on the computer, it’s systemized, it’s high tech. And now two years later, business is more efficient. They’re making more dough. There’s less loss of money. It’s less time invested in all the admin and the quoting and the getting of money. And now they think totally differently, but it’s because they went through that process. So there’s that. And also if you hang around with people who think a certain way, talk a certain way, have certain ideas and philosophies that are somewhat different to yours. Over time, for better or worse, their thinking will influence your thinking. I always say, if you’re the smartest in the room, Or the best in the room, go to another room. Yep. Go and hang out with people who drag you up. Yep. Right? I’ve been training with a guy for the last 15 years, one of my best mates in the world, ex pro bodybuilder. I’m in pretty good shape for my age, quite strong and fit and all that sh*t but I’m a complete novice compared to him. And the reason that I train with him is because he’s Well, one, we’re mates, but two, he’s better. I want to hang out with people who are smarter, who are stronger, who are more successful, who are better because I’m going to learn from them. And of course that’s not everyone is going to be like that, but yeah, as much as you can spend time with people who inspire you, who challenge you, who don’t always tell you what you want to hear. You don’t need a fucking fan club or a round of applause for getting out of bed. Or having a salad. And by the way, stop posting that shit on Instagram. Um, here’s my breakfast. Here’s a salad I ate. Wow. Well done, Scott. Uh, we don’t need that. 

 Andy
No, no.

Ange
Oh my gosh. That’s the best. Tradies, uh, definitely need to ensure that they’re around people who are going to pull them up. Any human does to be honest. As we all know, this knowledge growth is never ending. And I know for myself, the more I learn, the more I realize I don’t know. So we just, this evolution of constantly learning is really important. Just to change tact a little bit, Craig, I want to just talk about communication because it’s definitely vital when it comes to business, but it is clearly the way humans relate to each other and therefore that it’s a skillset they need to have. So What tips do you have for business owners to improve communication and build stronger relationships with their clients and their teams? 

Craig
Here’s my number one tip. Try and understand the person in front of you. Try and understand how they think. Try and understand their version of right now, not agree with them, not align with them, not even necessarily like them. Try to understand them because if you can’t understand the person in front of you, you can’t build rapport, connection, and trust. Right? There’s a thing in psychology called the false consensus effect. And basically it says that people assume that other people think like them. So when we think about this moment in time, as we are recording today, there’s three people in our producer. So we’ve got Ollie, Ange, Andy, and Craig, all listening right now, all involved right now, but no one’s having the same experience, right? And so we create our own experiences. So in real time today, for me, one of my jobs is to try to understand where Ange and Andy are at so that I can be of value and service to you. How do I make this as good as it can be for you? That’s what I think. How do I serve you? That’s what I think. How do I explain my thoughts and ideas and knowledge with an audience that are primarily tradies in a way that’s going to be meaningful for them and not psychobabble academic bullsh*t, right? But if you went, Oh, our audience are surgeons. And by the way, that’s not necessarily a better thing at all. It’s just a different group of humans. Right. Then I might approach it a little bit differently, but I go, all right, well, we’re talking to a bunch of business owners who work in this space. Let me, and of course, I’m going to get stuff wrong, but as much as I can, I’m going to try to be aware of, or have an understanding of the audience that I’m talking to. And in psychology, we call that theory of mind theory of mind is understanding the mindset of someone who’s not you. Because if you understand how someone else thinks and you understand someone else’s, in the moment reality, then that opens a doorway for better communication.

Ange
Absolutely great points because it makes no difference who you’re speaking with. You’re going to have a far better experience and or to your point, help them best when you actually understand. Where they’re coming from and their concerns. 

Craig
Also keep in mind that your intention is not their experience. So I might go, Oh, Hey guys, I’ve got some advice for you on how to do your podcast better. And you’re like, ah, okay, now my intention might be good. And I’ve done thousands of podcasts and I go, wow, we’ll love that. You know, so I might have really really good intentions and my desire is actually to be of value and service to you, but your experience might be that Craig Harper guy. I think he knows everything. Why is he giving us? Why is he being critical? Why is he? Right? So to understand that even your good intentions might not have a good outcome and that happens all the time. So this is why we need timing. We need situational awareness. We need theory of mind. We need to know when the f*ck do I shut up and when do I talk? Yeah. Because even if you’re right, sometimes saying it is wrong.

Ange
And so hence reading the body language on the other side of that becomes so important because you could hear something out of someone’s mind. But their body language will tell you a completely different story. 

Craig
That’s so true. They’re telling you yes, but they’ve got written all over.

 Andy
So Craig, um, I just want to ask one last piece of advice for tradies out there that may be struggling in business right now, what could you tell them?

Craig
I guess, you know, like in business, we have this idea or this acronym USP unique selling proposition, you know, like I coach a few speakers and I go, you know what? There are a lot of speakers. Why would somebody pay you a grand or two or three or four or five to stand in front of their group and talk to them? Um, because there’s a whole bunch of people who are already doing what you’re doing, but they’re better and they got more experience and they got more knowledge. And so like, I guess one of the reasons that I get, for example, I get work is because I know a bit of stuff and you know, I’ve got a fair bit of experience, but maybe the way that I communicate is not typical for a corporate coach, consultant or speaker. And so that’s a bit of a USP, unique selling proposition for me. And so, you know, your unique selling proposition as a tradie might just be that everything that you say you’re going to do. You do it on time. Yeah. I know for myself, I’ve got about five tradies in my orbit that I use for different things. And the reason that I use them is because they’re all great tradesmen and reliable. And for me, within reason, I don’t give a f*ck what they charge me. Yeah. Because I know they’re good and they’re reliable. And I care more about that. Then the dough. And of course, I don’t want to overpay, but at the same time, and you know, for me, like I do, okay, I’m, I’m, you know, my life is all right. I’m quite comfortable and I’m very grateful for that. But I tip, you know, this is if a, if a tradie does an 800 for me, I always give them a grant because I appreciate them and I want a good relationship with them. Yeah. You know what I mean? And so I think in, in business, just, just being that person that is, you know, and this sounds a bit naff and old school, but if you’ve got, if you know what your values are, if you operate, operate with integrity, if you are honest, if you show up when you say you’re going to show up, or if you can’t make a call and go, I’m really sorry, this is what’s going on. Right? Just keep people informed and treat people with respect. And it’s almost like, then the quality of your work is second. Like you might be a brilliant tradesman, but you’re a prick. Guess what? You’re not going to succeed. 

 Andy
Agreed. 

Ange
It’s true. 

 Andy
It’s going to be a lot harder. Hey mate, we always play this little game here on the, on the tradie show. So Ange and I are going to ask you three questions. You have around about 20 seconds each question is going to be rapidly fired. Are you ready? 

Craig
I’m so ready. I’m on the edge of my bloody seat. 

Ange
I can tell. 

Craig
I’m bursting out of my flannel. I’m bursting out of my work boots. 

Ange
Let’s do it. First question. What is one strategy you use to start your day right?

Craig
Coffee. 

 Andy
I love coffee first thing, too. 

Ange
Black. 

Craig
That’s it. Coffee, conversation. Every day I get out of bed and 15 minutes later, because I live on a main street with a million cafes, uh, 15 minutes later, I’m at the cafe, I’ve got coffee, and I set my intentions for the day. And I ask one question, based on what I want to do, to create and change today, what’s the best use of my time?

 Andy
Absolutely love that. And what is something that has made you smile recently? 

Craig
Uh, I laugh at silly shits. So if you do something dumb or silly, like I am, emotionally 12 years old. I love watching people hurt themselves. I love stupid videos. Not really hurt themselves. I love dumb and I have a lot of intense conversations. So I need that pendulum to swing the other way where, you know, I feel like if you’re not laughing, then life is ****.

 Andy
Love that. 

Ange
Laughter is good for humans. I totally agree. So Craig, what’s the best piece of advice you’ve ever received? 

Craig
The best piece of advice I’ve ever received is that when I was young, I was very, um, uh, churchy and I had a pastor in my church when I was 20, 21. And he came up to me and he said, he called, he was old. It was in his seventies. And I was, I think I was 20. And he said to me, he called everyone dear one. And he said to me, dear one, you need to decide what you’re going to do with that tongue of yours, because it’s a gift. You can destroy people or you can build them up and it’s a responsibility you need to think about what you’re going to do. So that ability to be able to communicate and talk and either elevate people or destroy people basically said to me you need to figure out what you’re going to do with your ability that you have to communicate cause you can make people better or worse. And that really was a shock to me because my default setting sometimes is that I’m a smart ass, which doesn’t is not a good thing. But so if somebody would have a go at me, I would slice, dice and Julianne them with my words. Right. And I’m like, Oh, but they started it. Well, Craig, it doesn’t matter. You know? So for me, it’s about something that was very powerful for me. There’s been a lot of advice, but being very mindful of how I talk to people and the way that I use my ability to communicate that kind of opened a door in my brain that led me to do better things.

 Andy
Yeah, I absolutely love that, mate. It’s been awesome chatting with you today, you know, you got so much wisdom and thanks so much for being here on The Tradie Show. Hopefully this is going to inspire a lot of tradies out there to improve not only their business. but also their lives. Thanks very much, mate.

Craig
Thanks for having me, team. Appreciate you and congrats on what you’re doing. It’s amazing. 

Ange
Thanks, Craig. Real honor to have you in front of all of our tradies at our live event, but also to share your wisdom yet again here. We appreciate your time. That’s it for us this week, crew. Make sure you tune in next week for another great episode of The Tradie Show.

 Andy
Have a cracking week.  

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