Full time vs subbies: which is better for business? Check out Andy’s pro/con list

Ange
Yeah. And it’s one every business owner needs to consider. The other day, I actually saw a tradie who asked on Facebook, literally word for word, it said something like, should I change my business structure and my team from full-time to subbies to avoid wasting wages during covid? So how incredible that I’ve literally pulled this one out of the box to talk about for this week.

Andy
Yeah, it’s absolutely crazy and it’s on everyone’s lips, isn’t it, with what’s going on around Australia and around the world. But personally, I get asked this so many times, and it really depends on what stage of business you’re in, how much control you wanna have over your team, and really what kind of trade business owner you are, and what trade you do.

Ange
Sure. Not to mention throwing Covid into the mix over the last few years has certainly changed the landscape of hiring tradespeople, right?

Andy
Yeah, a hundred percent.

Ange
So whilst we’ve done pretty well as tradies now with so many people in isolation, it’s actually no wonder that people are questioning their staffing mix.

Andy
Yeah, and a hundred percent. I know everyone out there listening to it now, it’s like, oh my God. You know? Seems like every second person is having a day off here and there, and they’ve got Covid and are having weeks off. It’s absolutely crazy. Okay, then well, let’s give this a crack based on our experience within our plumbing business and also the experiences our Lifestyle Tradie members have had. So what is better for business? Full-time employees? Or is it subbies?

Ange
All right. This is gonna be interesting cuz I can actually argue for both sides of this.

Andy
Oh, I think everyone can. Everyone can. And that’s why we’re gonna talk about it today.

Ange
Rightio, you wanna kick off?

Andy
Yes. I’m gonna kick it off Ange and let’s look at the positive things for subbies. There’s a lot of things out there that having a subbie to come and give you a hand is awesome because sometimes you’re not busy enough to have a full-time employee. So it’s really handy that when you’re busy for a couple of days a week, maybe not five days a week, that you can bring a subbie in to test the water, to see how it goes, to take a little bit of stress off you and your business and maybe just maybe it gives you a chance to work on other things in business as well.

Ange
Yeah, sure. And in reality, we all understand that you do have these peaks and troughs of, you know, workload within a week. So what’s cool about that is on that day that you go, oh my God, I’m so hectic. I’ve said yes to so much work in this particular week, but next week’s not so busy you could actually pull in a subbie and even just for a couple of days this week, like literally I want them tomorrow.

Andy
And that’s the biggest thing with trade business owners. They’re reactive. Yes. So when they’re really, really busy, they’re like, oh my God, I can’t keep up. Just keep working. Hang on! I need staff, but then in a week or two weeks maybe they’re not busy now. Yes. And they’ve got, well, I, if I get a staff member and I’m not busy, wow. It’s gonna cost me a fortune.

Ange
Absolutely. We talk about these different phases of business, right? We talk about startup scale up and sell up. So subbies are really good when you’re in this startup phase, which is, yes. What you’re talking about here, you know, specifically is being able to pull in a subbie when you’ve not too sure about your workload each week, right? So it’s really, really good from the startup phase.

Andy
Yeah, you’re right. I mean, the startup stage is certainly a time when people use subbies, but actually it’s every stage of business you could use a subbie. It’s sometimes, sure, you’ve just got so much work, it’s just the right time to bring someone in, help you with the load, get some of the backlog out the way so you can refocus.

Ange
Yeah, that’s a really valid point. So whilst we’re talking about pros for subbies, you kind of touched on this, but you actually said what’s cool about subbies is you can actually get them to do your workload, for instance, during the week, like load them up Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, and you use those three days to actually be off the tools and actually work on the business. So what I mean by that is, It’s really cool to be out there and be the plumber or electrician or whatever, work with your hands. But there is another side of business, this admin side, about getting your job management system right, and your marketing right, and dealing with the finance and calling people to, you know, pull in this money. Like there’s a whole nother side that needs time. So who’s doing that?

Andy
Yeah, a hundred percent. And I think it’s that old saying and, and you hear us say it a lot, you can be the best tradie in the world. That doesn’t mean you’re gonna be successful and make a lot of money. It really is the business people that are the ones that are making the money. And we’ve gotta learn how to be a business owner. So sometimes by bringing someone in that just wants to work with his hands and get the job done, and that’ll just give you that little bit of extra time to make sure you know your numbers, you know what’s going on, you’re bringing in more work, and it really just takes maybe that stress level away as well. Yes. Helps you be a bit more organized.

Ange
Yes, I totally agree with that. Another pro is there is absolutely no commitment to any of your subbies.

Andy
Ah, I like this one because if you don’t like them, you can just move on quick and simple, because let’s face it, sometimes you have personality clashes. As we said earlier, the work is sometimes there, but it’s not there the next day. So you know, it’s a really easy way for us to sort of say, listen mate, thanks for the help, but see you later.

Ange
Yeah. There’s no binding agreements. Right? If they worked with you this week, they might not work for you next week. It’s, it’s easy.

Andy
It is easy. And the other big thing, the other pro as well, is all around the responsibility of annual leave and sick leave and, and obviously the way the world is at the moment, sick leave and that it’s just a nightmare. It just feels like, Business owners these days, it’s just commonplace that everyone just is allowed to use their sick leave. Where when I was growing up, it was like you’d have a pile of sick leave that you’d never, ever touch.

Ange
Yes. Well, the HR component about contracts and about your responsibilities. If you had a full-timer as an example, Must be followed to the letter. So this is where Subbies is really an advantage because they literally invoice you for the week. You pay the bill and you don’t have to think about them ever again until next time you bring them in.

Andy
A hundred percent. And I think subbies tend to work well with different industries as well. You know, like trade industries, you know, like I think carpenters and roofers and builders. Yes. You know, I mean, you can have subbies in every trade of course, but I think there’s some subbies that fit in better for that style of work.

Ange
That’s right. When you’re considering, for instance, a carpenter who’s doing a three month job and that Subbie just gets contracted, well, not even contracted, you just make an agreement that they’re gonna work for that three months until that job is finished and then it’s over.

Andy
And I think sometimes those bigger projects, the actual subbie themselves, aren’t having that connection with the client. Yes, or the owner or the person you’re working for. So they’re just pretty much there doing their job, smashing it out, and as long as they’re doing a good job and they’re knocking it over, we’re sort of happy they don’t have that client relationship.

Ange
Yes. And all of these points about the positives of subbies are all great, but there’s always another side of the coin.

Andy
Yeah, there definitely is. And there’s some big negatives around subbies as well, and I think the biggest one is how do you find top class subbies that wanna work with you all the time?

Ange
Sure.

Andy
Because a lot of the time subbies, they just want the best ones, they just wanna go out on their own and do their own things. So we all know that finding staff, if it’s a subbie or, or if it’s a full-time person, is really hard. It’s as rare as hen’s teeth, you know.

Ange
What? Sorry, what? .

Andy
Have you ever heard of that rare hen’s teeth?

Ange
No. What does it mean?

Andy
I don’t really know what it means, but I’m assuming a hen doesn’t have teeth. . Does that sound about right? I think it does. I don’t think they have teeth. There’s no way.

Ange
Oh my God, you are really showing your age.

Andy
Yeah. I don’t where, where I get this shit from? I’ve got no idea.

Ange
I have no idea. But that was a bad one. So I agree. Subbies are hard to find and one of the biggest negatives I reckon is about consistency.

Andy
Yes. A hundred percent consistency because when you have a full-time employee, you tell them what to do all day, every day, and they just have to do it. And if they don’t, they don’t have a job. Yes. But with a subbie, they seem to push the boundaries. It’s like, it’s a bit like, well, I’m a subbie. I’m my own business, so yes, I’ll come and subbie you when it suits me. Yes, I’ll work with you when it suits me, but I don’t wanna do all the paperwork. I don’t wanna talk to the clients. I don’t wanna do any of that stuff that’s gonna help you in the office later. Yes, because they’re like, if I’m gonna do all that, I might just run my own business. I just wanna be a subbie, get on the tools, get my shit done, and leave.

Ange
Yes. What you’ve actually said right there are what I consider two negatives. The first one you said was negative because subbies can dictate their own week, for instance, and they have so much available work right now. Yes. They will prioritize their own customers over your work in a heartbeat. Right. So it’s time,

Andy
Especially in this day and age when there’s so much work outta there. Yes. Most subbies are like, I’m not gonna come and subby for you. There’s like a pile of work over there I can get and earn more money. Right. And then at Christmas time, because what do they do?

Ange
What?

Andy
Well, they go, well, I don’t wanna work for a month. So now you’ve lost them.

Ange
Yes. And you are paying them maybe 80 bucks an hour, but they could be charging.

Andy
Well, that’s pretty high, but you’re right. There are some tradies at 80. But I’d say the normal subbie rate used to be pre covid between 50 and 60.

Ange
Okay. Depends on your trade, I’m sure. Probably too. Right?

Andy
A hundred percent.

Ange
However, if they do their own work, they’re probably charging a hundred, $150 an hour.

Andy
A hundred plus. There’s no doubt about it. Yes. So then they like, but a lot of subbies, they’re dipping their toe in the water as well.

Ange
I agree.

Andy
They’re dipping their toes in the water. They’re like, oh, I don’t wanna be a full-blooded business owner, cuz I’ve seen my past bosses and all the stress and I just want to go fishing and dirt bike riding and jet testing and do whatever I want when I want. But on the other hand, the money, money wants the money. They wanna make the money too.

Ange
So the other point you actually made that I wanna talk about individually is the fact that you said when subbies come to work with you, they don’t wanna follow your systems. Cuz they just literally wanna work on the tools. They don’t wanna follow your paperwork, they don’t wanna use the job management system that you use. And when you tell me there are systems like 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, follow these rules don’t deviate. They just go, screw that. Just let me just do my trade.

Andy
Yeah. In our style of work, in the maintenance plumbing game and the way we ran our business, everything was completely systemized and everyone in the whole company had to do it exactly the same way every single time.

Ange
Follow a process.

Andy
Yep. And that saved us a bucket load of time in the office and dramas and working back late and all this kind of stuff. Right. But we found that when we got subbies to come in and give us a hand. They didn’t wanna follow our structure, they didn’t wanna follow our systems. It all came a bit hard for them. They don’t wanna do the work and go home. Yes. And that’s a big negative for subbies.

Ange
Yes, it is. And another massive negative is the fact that some trade business owners go, I love having subbies, but I actually want them to be working like a full-time employee and I’m gonna schedule five days a week of work and legally, We’re not allowed to do this.

Andy
No, you’re not. You can, it’s an 80/20 split. Yes. Um, and you’ve gotta make sure they don’t work any more than 80% of the time with one contractor or one owner.

Ange
One trade business owner.

Andy
One trade business owner. Yeah, that’s right.

Ange
So it creates a huge amount of pressure as a trade business owner that if you’re thinking to yourself, subbies is the way to go, this is a massive, you know, benefit to me is to use them, you’ve got to actually consider this can actually be a bit of a negative because as your business grows and you’ve scaled and you’ve included them in the scale to do full-time work for you. As a subbie, you’re not allowed. So just be sure that you are considerate of the fact.

Andy
That’s right. And I think probably the biggest one with subbies is these whole callbacks. Yes. So if you are getting in to go do work and then they stuff it up, you are sort of hiring another contractor, so by right, you can go back to them and say, you need to fix this. Yes. But the problem is a lot of the time the clients are our clients. Yes. And it’s very hard to get a subbie to return and to do that work. So callbacks are a really funny scenario. And let’s face it, callbacks aren’t always callbacks. Sometimes the customer thinks it’s at a callback. But it’s not so, It’s got blurred lines around callbacks on exactly what needs to be done. So it is a real tough one in regards to that.

Ange
But if that customer was mine, my repeat client as an example, or my customer first and I had a contract, do that work, I completely understand that that’s a negative, cause I as an owner are just gonna go, I can’t screw this up. I’m just gonna have to go back and do this job at my cost.

Andy
That’s right. And that’s exactly what we always did. Right. You know? But because otherwise that customer would never use you ever again because you sort of passed the buck. You’ve brought someone in to take the load off you, but you’ve passed the buck to someone else.

Ange
They’re all awesome points, but there is another major negative when it comes to subbies. You’ve really got to be considerate of your brand and your consistency out in the market and how customers see you in every single phase of that word, meaning your website looks a certain way and all your paraphernalia. So if we just talked about vehicles as an example, what do they show up in?

Andy
Yeah, that’s right. They’re rocking up in their Utes and they’ve got different, their own branding and well, their own branding. That’s definitely a problem. Uh, I find a lot of subbies don’t have their own branding, but they’ve, some subbies could have, you know, like, um, those dangling balls hanging off the toe ball, you know, but they’ve got things that probably aren’t appropriate on their car that customers might look at and go, what? Who is this person? Do I need them in the house? I brought this company because I know and trust them, and now they’ve bought an outsider to come in and do the work in my house that I don’t really know. And I can see that they may not be in the same branding. They’re not in the same trucks. And then the client starts to second guess why and are they shaven? What’s their hair like? Where are their tats? I mean, all those things coming into it.

Ange
Yes. And I suppose this also depends now specifically about what trade you are specifically. So if you’re a builder and you’ve got a subbie coming on site and he’s showing up in a, you know, plain white ute, it’s easy just to give him a shirt and say, you need to look like this when you’re on site. But when you’re in maintenance and they’re actually, you’re showing up and the rest of your vehicles are, you know, wrapped, for instance, and this guy shows up and his vehicle’s not wrapped, it does look very inconsistent if that customer were to know you. So this does actually change.

Andy
I think when you’re looking at branding, it’s not ideal, but when you’re looking at it, you are under the pump, you’ve got so much work and you need someone to help you, then you probably don’t worry about branding just for that instance. You let them come. But the biggest problem with getting tradies and, and this is part of my story with our plumbing business, getting them to come in is, they just don’t follow any of our systems. They don’t abide by any of our processes. They weren’t collecting the money, they weren’t signing up, they weren’t quoting the job. There were so many things they weren’t doing that we needed. So we had to change the way we used Subbies and we used them more on our bigger jobs. So we would sell the job first. Yes. And whatever that was, and then we can get them to come in. But we’d always have them work with one of our guys now. And our guy was always in control and that worked not too bad.

Ange
Yeah. You did the quote and the quote included employing a subbie for X number of days.

Andy
Yeah, that’s right. I mean, we wouldn’t have that on the actual quote.

Ange
No, no, I understand that,

Andy
But yeah, yeah, exactly. So we’d, we’d go, okay, well normally we wouldn’t allow for a quote for a subbie. We’d just think of what we need to do this job? And then if we didn’t have the manpower, we could ring old John O up, Hey John O what are you up to mates?

Ange
And it would speed you up.

Andy
Well, that’s right. And speed us up and get through the job. But we keep one of our guys always on there with him who dealt with the customer.

Ange
That’s a really good point. So overall subbies can be tricky and the only way to have full control and ensure that they’re doing things your way is to employ them full-time. So, alright, let’s talk about pros and cons and change tactics and talk about full-time employees.

Andy
Yeah. I mean, the way we’ve always done it is with full-time employees. When I first started in the early days as we talked about subbies, it was quite good to get started. Yes, but then full-time employees were the only way to fly. I will just put a bit of a caveat out there. In this day and age, you just need tradies. Tradies full-time or subbies, whatever they are, you just gotta find them and you just gotta use them. So that’s where it’s been hard, but I believe that full time’s definitely the way to go because it’s too fickle with the subbies, and you just never know when you’ve got a full-time staff member, they’re locked in, they’re loaded, and they’re with you and your uniform and your truck, and your tools, and they can’t just run away and start their own business. If they wanna start their own business, they’ve gotta buy their own truck. They’ve gotta get more tools and it’s an expense. And it’s hard sometimes for an employee to step away.

Ange
What you are talking about there is control. You wanna be able to control them.

Andy
Well, most business owners are control freaks. That’s fake. Face it. And um, if you haven’t heard our control freak episode, go back and listen to that one. It’s a cracker. But um, yeah, we are control freaks. Yes. And we want it our way and we wanna do it a certain way. And that’s why we became a business owner, isn’t it? So we could have it done our way.

Ange
And expect everyone to follow suit. Yes. This is very true.

Andy
Yeah. And full-time. When you have full-time workers, they make you hustle for work. I remember when I had one of my very first bosses when I was an apprentice and I was about to go out on my own. Yes. When I got qualified. And he said, get yourself an apprentice. I said, why? He said, because they’re gonna rock up to your door every morning and knock on it and you’re gonna have to get up cuz you’ve got someone to hold. Holding you accountable, holding you accountable. Right. So that was definitely one, but it certainly makes you hustle for work. Cause there is nothing worse than having staff with nothing to do.

Ange
And you’re paying them.

Andy
It makes you be more organized, when you’re a one man show and it’s just, you go, oh, I got no work tomorrow. Go beauty. I’m going to the beach.

Ange
Absolutely.

Andy
But when you get staff, you push through time and time again.

Ange
Yes. And a definite pro is the fact that when you have a plan of scaling your business because the whole intent, as we understand as trade business owners, one of your biggest goals is to ensure that you have more time. Meaning if you wanna take a day off and go see your kid at a carnival or whatever, you wanna ensure that other team members are still working profitably whilst you are not there. And the only way to do that and to scale properly is to ensure that you have someone who understands your business like you do, which means you can scale.

Andy
Yeah, and, and I think just looking over, say the Christmas period again, there’s so many tradies I talked to and they were one man shows and they go away for a week or two weeks with the family and they’ve, they’re allowing 10 to 15 grand for that, but they’ve also lost about five grand a week as well. So put another 10 grand on the 15. Now they’ve gone away for two weeks. It cost them 25 grand and they’re like, oh my God, I know I need a holiday. But I almost can’t afford a holiday. Sure. When you have more staff, the business still can be making money and ticking over and making profit, and you feel like you can get away.

Ange
Absolutely. And to add to that, it even compounds even more because it’s like feeding the beast. You as a business owner are perhaps outdoing quotes and getting quotes approved, which keeps the machine operating. And if you’ve taken time off and these full-time employees aren’t there to pull up the slack and allow you to take that break, then the machine stops. And guess what? You come home and there’s like a couple of weeks of gap where nothing is actually happening and no money’s getting made.

Andy
A hundred percent, people rush to do their work. They come back home and they’re like, Ooh, hang on. I’ve got nothing lined up. Because work breeds more work. Yes. So when you’re not working, you’re not breeding that extra work. So that’s a hundred percent right.

Ange
Yes. So this is where you need full-time employees to work tradesmen, tradespeople, to be on the tools profitably working with you so that you can actually take this time off. Really, really important and another great benefit of having full-time employees is the fact that they’re more sustainable. And what I mean by that is over time you have this opportunity to get to know them really well. Not just them, but their partners, and actually build a bond with them. They understand the vision of the business, they understand the importance of their impact and their decision making so that you grow together. You build this incredible culture together, and this is what ensures loyalty and long-term sustainability with you.

Andy
Yeah, and we’ve been working a lot with a lot of our guys, haven’t we, around this whole loyalty and making sure your, your staff are sticking and there’s a lot of people out I know that are losing staff to other companies left, right, and center at the moment. So, you know, we, we were working on this probably four or five months ago cause I knew it was coming. Yes. But, um, this whole, getting your team to have buy-in and looking after them, have an amazing culture and everything you said, a good business right there is one that’s got this incredible culture and everyone’s there to help each other and, and I know as trade business owners, it’s hard to get there, but I guarantee you when you are and every time there’s a bad apple, you get them out straight away. If you can build that culture, choosing the business is going well.

Ange
Yeah, we spend a lot of time with our Lifestyle Tradie members talking about the team, don’t we? About,

Andy
Oh a hundred percent.

Ange
How do we engage them better and retain them better and motivate them and it all does come back to this culture piece because your team right now, it makes or breaks you. It always has. I shouldn’t say it only does now it does all the time, but even more so now, there’s even stats in the marketplace that they’re saying that right now people will jump ship really, really fast and this is their opportunity for change. But to me, I see this as, this is your opportunity as a trade business owner to perhaps pick up a new full-time person because they perhaps are jumping ship from that previous employer.

Andy
Yeah, a hundred percent. It’s certainly been a great resignation. As I said, the grass is greener. Yes, you name it, it’s been out there. We, um, worked very heavily with our members to make sure they locked everyone in, which worked to treat them, and they’ve been lucky enough to pick a few of the good ones out from the sides as well. So it all comes down with having a good culture, new business, a good structure, and actually knowing exactly what you want. If you can do that, wow, you gotta kill a business and people actually want to come and work for you because of what you do, and that’s what you’re trying to build here.

Ange
Yes. However, let’s look at the other side of this because although there are some definite positives with full-time team members, there are absolutely some negatives. So let’s go there.

Andy
Holy Yeah.. You know, there’s definitely negatives, isn’t there? You know? And um, the biggest one, Is just finding the good staff. Yes, the good staff that wanna stay around for the long term too. I mean, you know, it’s all well and good to find someone that’s gonna fit and be a part of your culture, but you know, you bring them in, you spend heaps of time with them, you train them up, you do everything they need. You make them into this killer tradie, and then they go. Ah. Sorry mate. I’m gonna get my own. I’m like, oh no, you’re killing me.

Ange
No, it’s true. It is a headache, but to your point, it’s hard to find good full-time staff members. And from a trades person perspective, we need to be hunting for them all the time. You need to always have this add up. We’ve actually done a full episode, I believe in season one, which was all about why hiring is so hard? And we share a guide on how to hire top-notch staff. So if you guys are out there, uh, having this issue right now, then perhaps go back and check out that episode. I think it might help.

Andy
A hundred percent. And I think the biggest thing is when people wanna find staff, they do the same thing that everyone else is doing. They wax something on Indeed and Seek. With a thousand other tradies looking for the exact same person. And they expect a different result. And that’s why with our members, we have done a lot of really cool stuff that has helped them bring some top quality people in. So go and listen to that episode. You’ll love it.

Ange
Yes. So one of the other negatives I wanna talk about is something that you actually explained as a positive, but I can actually see a negative in this side too, which is having a full-time trades spend makes you hustle for work. So this can actually be seen as a negative, the fact that you have to hustle for work. Like what pressure?

Andy
Well, yeah. There’s a lot of pressure isn’t there? And there’s nothing that a business owner hates to see more than trucks sitting on the side of the road or sitting in the warehouse and guys grooming the warehouse or cleaning the warehouse.

Ange
Work that day over.

Andy
Yeah. Working it at about 20% of their capacity and just cruising it.

Ange
Getting paid.

Andy
Yeah, getting paid full Tilda, nothing does your head in more?

Ange
Yes. So it’s important to actually give all of your work, say you, it’s only you and one other trades person at this point, for instance. It’s important to give all your work to them so that you actually spend your time doing other stuff, working on the business, this admin side that we keep talking about.

Andy
Yeah, a hundred percent. But I mean, it’s becoming more and more apparent for some people out there as well that guys are wanting to work with these smaller business owners where the actual business owner is actually full-time on the tools too. That’s, that’s real swings and roundabouts and, and a lot of people are looking going, well, hang on, I wanna find a business owner that has two or three guys and he’s on the tools and he’s in the trenches and he’s doing the hard yards as well.

Ange
Yeah, that can be seen as a negative. Hey, and another negative. Again, we talked about this as a positive, but it’s also not good, when you decide to go away and maybe it’s you and a couple of other guys. Uh, what happens cuz you are now on holiday and you a hundred percent are going to go because you haven’t been on family holiday forever and it’s been booked in for such a long time. So what do you do with them?

Andy
Well, that’s it. But I mean, if you’re gonna have a business at this level, you need to be not on the tools to a point that you’ve actually organized enough work and you’ve got a structure and a system around how you do that. But you’re right, there’s a lot of business owners going, I’m going away. And yeah, if the phone rings, go do that job. But really why They’re away for, say, a week or two weeks. The actual tradies themselves are working at 30, 40% tops and just cruising, going, oh yeah, I don’t mind this Christmas time. You know, this is all right. And the owner does get to a point where I’ve got nothing organized. I dunno if the phones ring, but you know what? I just don’t care. I’m just gonna go. But it still ends up burning holes in his pocket because he’s gotta pay for those staff.

Ange
I was about to say exactly that. More often than not, a lot of trade business owners come into this period of time, this Christmas period in January saying, I know I’m going to be making a loss in this timeframe of x amount of money and they just, they’ve kind of just budgeted that in, or in fact not budgeted because no trade business owners budget, let’s be honest.

Andy
No. A challenge. Well, some do. Some do. You can’t. You can’t put that brush over everyone I know.

Ange
Fair enough.

Andy
But a small percentage, yes. Only do that.

Ange
So this brings me back to, if that is the case, then the rest of your team, it’s really important they understand all of your systems that keep you functioning so that you can continue to do work. And what I mean by that, They need to be able to answer the phone correctly and use the job management system correctly so that they can actually answer phones, do the work, and continue whilst you’re on holiday.

Andy
Yeah, they’re gotta do all the things that you do as a boss, as, as best way they can. But I think one of the biggest negatives as well is they get their four weeks holiday, which is fine, and they get their six sick days and we know that and they get all their public holidays and that’s all sort of in on the price that you pay them. The problem is when you are not dictating to them when they have holidays, they’re dictating to you. Or if, you know, with Covid and everything happening, they’re using all their sick days and I mean, this is where business owners at the moment are really struggling with their stuff and it’s hitting the hip pocket of us tradies because you know, you send one of your guys go on two week holidays because you had nothing for them, and you think Yep, they do that every year. They get covid and they get a positive test. That all have to be paid in sick leave, is the law. And it’s like, oh my God. Now I gotta, not only do we not earn any money, but I gotta pay the sick leave.

Ange
Yes. And in the current climate, we’re definitely seeing where a lot of trade business owners have contracts with maybe schools or mines or whatever, and the client or customer had this criteria whereby they have to show the covid. You know, vaccinations and a lot of the team have said no to vaccines. So I mean, that is a controversial subject I know, but it is something that’s definitely hitting our industry hard.

Andy
Yeah, I mean, I suppose you’re looking in Australia or, or I say New South Wales at the moment, but we’re nearly at around 95% vax, double vax. Now I’m not saying that I’m pro or I’m not, I mean I have had my vax. I will say that. But listen, I reckon everyone should make their own decisions. Sure. But there’s a lot of politics around that and I’m not gonna go down that path. But yeah, it’s made it really hard for business owners cuz even a few of our members have had to let staff go because they’re so, they’re anti-vaxxers and that’s cool. I’m okay with it, but that’s their decision. But it’s been very hard for the business owner. Listen, I think the last two years it’s been hard for the business owner, but it’s been hard for the staff. I think everyone’s been totally knocked around their head with a cricket bat for a little while. Yeah. And has softened us up.

Ange
Everyone hates change, right?

Andy
Oh, they do.

Ange
We’ve been thrown into the most chaotic period of life. However, this subject matter is, you know how they hear this statement that says, don’t ever talk to anybody around religion and politics. Well, now it’s, don’t ever talk to anyone about religion, politics, and covid because everyone has an opinion.

Andy
Oh, yeah. And some people are so opinionated they drive me nuts.

Ange
Totally.

Andy
They just, they just, they’re,

Ange
They’re conspiracy theorists.

Andy
Oh, well, it’s not just, no, I’m not even saying that. Some of the conspiracy theorists people, I, I, I don’t mind hearing some of their comments. But I even find on the other side of the people that are pro-vax, right? They’re so nut bags as well. And then preaching like, mate, I don’t, I’ll just do what I wanna do. I don’t wanna listen to all this shit.

Ange
Okay. Okay. I’m totally gonna get you off this thread cuz this is really dangerous.

Andy
It’s really dangerous. And you know what, I bat for both sides. So I, what’s, well, I don’t. No, we take that back. When it comes to Vaccine, anti-vax, I can see both sides. That’s what I’m saying.

Ange
Like I said, don’t get us in trouble.

Andy
Oh dear.

Ange
So we’re talking about full-time and

Andy
Back to both sides. Come on,

Ange
You’re a shocker. So balancing your team, may it be like full-time trade people or subbies, is really gonna depend on your trade and the stage of business that you are in. Whether it’s a startup, scale up or sell up.

Andy
Yeah, that’s it. And it’s gonna be a really, a financial and personal commitment for every trade business out there. You’ve gotta weigh up the pros and cons and make the decision that fits right for you.

Ange
Correct. So, before we wrap up today’s episode, Andy and I wanna introduce a new part of the show, the Tradie News Bulletin. So Andy, what’s in the news today?

Andy
Ah, I feel like a news anchor. Love it. Right. So Ange, I’ve heard a whisper that the Australian Antarctic program is looking for 200 awesome tradies to go live with the penguins for a year. Wow.

Ange
Wow. Totally. Yeah. And guess what you heard, right? If you are willing to ditch sunny Aussie beaches for icebergs, the Antarctic research stations have job openings for plumbers, electricians, and engineering supervisors for the 2022 expeditions.

Andy
Realistically, as business owners, we’re not gonna ditch our companies and strap on the snow boots for a year, but this story got me thinking. There’s been a lot of talk recently about how hard it is to find good tradies and that the next generation doesn’t even think about being a tradie as a good job because technology-based jobs are seen as the future.

Ange
Yeah. You’re so right about that, Andy. There is a massive gap in the trade industry. I actually read an article that eight out of nine construction trades were found to be a national shortage.

Andy
Yeah, that is crazy, right? The trade industry is an awesome industry, and being a trade business owner comes with so many perks.

Ange
So true. But hang on a sec. What does tradies shortages have to do with living with the penguins for a year?

Andy
Well, everything really, kids aren’t seeing the awesome benefits of being a tradie. So it’s great to see these new stories like this that show kids that if they take on a trade, they can literally travel the world and have a one of a kind experience that they could never have anywhere else.

Ange
Yeah, so true. And a second that the program announced that this year they’ve turned the focus to finding female tradies to fill the roles. So not only are kids in general not being pushed to consider trades, but according to the ABC news, women make up only 3% of Australia’s skilled trade sector. So you know what? To me, it’s great to see that women are being prioritized for these once of a lifetime jobs.

Andy
Honestly, it’s a resume golden ticket. You’d be handed any job you wanted after working as a tradie in the Antarctic for a year. I mean, I’ll tell you that when I worked in Canada out in the snow, it was bloody tough and anyone that can hang out in those cold conditions and stay in the Antarctic for that long must be an absolute superstar and there wouldn’t be a lot of winging and moaning coming from them.

Ange
I heard that one of the work perks is that you can even visit penguin colonies on your days off. What a cool experience.

Andy
Yeah, you can swim in the pool. You can go for a sun bake. Oh, maybe not that.

Ange
Maybe a snow bake. So you’re right though, Andy. Hopefully we start to see more and more of these positive trade stories in the news so that kids, parents and teachers can see the amazing benefits of becoming a tradie. You can travel the world and have incredible life experiences. We’ve really got to start focusing on getting kids back into trades. It’s already a nightmare out there, and it’s only gonna get worse.

Andy
Spot on Ange. Well, that’s it from all of us here today in the newsroom. But for the full news story, check out the news link in the show notes.

Ange
It can be so tricky to strike the balance between your staffing mix. May that be subbies, full-time, part-time virtual assistants, uh, both with your tradespeople on the tools and your admin team, and perhaps you’ve got too many or perhaps too few staff or subbies and are a bit hit and miss. You know what, it’s actually really important we sort this out ASAP.

Andy
Your team is such an important element to get right within your business, so let’s not waste any more time guessing if you’ve done the right thing with trial and error because it is an expensive game.

Ange
Yes. If you wanna chat about your team or perhaps any other trade business headache you might be having right now, can I suggest you? Head to lifestyletradie.com.au and book in a free strategy session with Andy. The right decisions are far easier to make when you talk them out with someone that actually understands you.

Andy
Yep, that is a hundred percent true and guess what? We are happy to help. Well, that’s all from us today. Catch you next week.

Ange
See you later.